DIY W Rails
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@biell When my board with WTF is level, the app shows -3.7 deg. So assuming WTF are 4.2 deg, it would mean that it would be sitting nose-down by 0.5 deg on straight rails for the app to show 0. When the board is really level, this would be -0.5 in the app.
So your board still deviates 1.27 deg extra..
The pcb is mounted under the lid with 3mm spacers. You could remove (or replace with shorter spacers) the front ones which will not mess too much with the connectors (opposite tilting also puts them at an angle which is no problem).
Edit: see img when i tilted the frontside
Only thing is the thermal pad, and if anything on the underside of pcb gets pinched against the lid.. gotta see if there's any issues there. I think this could work.
Edit: maybe not..there's lotsa stuff in the front that could be pinched against the lid without any spacer. Need to open to really see?!
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@lia Thanks, depending on how this shapes up, it could be a starting point for me. Either by trying to make the angle less with WTF rails or by flipping it for straight rails. It will also depend on if it is sold as a product or provided as an STL.
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@maciak Thanks, I thought about that but was worried about the thermal pad. If you learn something there, please let me know. I haven't opened the controller since I decided this was a problem, so I also want to take a look at the board to see if something looks wrong on there, too.
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@lia Nice thought about JBWeld, I hadn't thought of that. That would certainly make one part of the mod easier. Thank you.
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I think I may have an idea, I could get the FAF Varials and flip the center piece's left and right sides. It might just be enough to even everything out and have me ride near level. I might reach out to Jeff to ask about this. If I hear anything back, I will let you know.
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From reddit (Linky)
TFL have successfully patented their WRail design, can't say I expected that so I wonder if there was a concern that other companies or even FM were planning to make and build their own?Anyway here it is on Google Patents with a few notable drawings from it.
https://patents.google.com/patent/US11325021B1/
@MacIak @biell In the patent (towards the end) are approximate dimensions and angles so that should answer our earlier questions :)
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@lia Funny, they were granted a patent this month for a product they stopped selling months ago. I wonder if the are going to patent varirails now, I can only assume they plan to. Then, maybe I can look up the specs on the FAF rails.
The tilt is 5° on WTF rails.
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@biell AFAIK was 3 degrees. They were talking in the tech rails group in facebook
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@ed_co So it is a bit confusing reading the patent. They clearly state that the footpad section is 3.7° relative to the center section in some parts, but then discuss a net 5° tilt throughout the rest of the narrative. So, if I understand what I am reading (which I may not), then the specific locations of the pivot points come into play, and the net board down-angle is, in fact, 5° when a normal board is registering as level while engaged (in e.g. Mission), but at rest.
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@biell said in DIY W Rails:
@ed_co So it is a bit confusing reading the patent. They clearly state that the footpad section is 3.7° relative to the center section in some parts, but then discuss a net 5° tilt throughout the rest of the narrative. So, if I understand what I am reading (which I may not), then the specific locations of the pivot points come into play, and the net board down-angle is, in fact, 5° when a normal board is registering as level while engaged (in e.g. Mission), but at rest.
Maybe is easy to solve:
@MacIak could you please let us know what is the exact angle of the controller box (without any tilting method) in your WTF rails? Thanks -
@ed_co I got a confirmation from Fungineers that the new rails for the SF motor is will be compatible with XR .
Looks like WTF rails. Not a rendering anymore, but a preproduction sample. Seems like you can assemble a XR clone with a Lfocer v3 and without a need for a controller tilt kit. All from offshore parts.
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Is it me? Or do those rails not look like they're angled up? Although in doing so might put them at risk of violating TFL's patent.... It'd be the shaping at least that's the point of contention, but the multiple holes to change axle height could be enough difference...
While, I'm all for things like this, and IP protection, it's a slippery slope that I think can lead to stagnation in time; once there's enough saturation, as you won't be able to do something without stepping on someone's toes.
"... We've been trying to reach you about abandoning the OW as a platform, and convert to EUCs."
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@samuraipunch Probably an infringement, but offshore, so who knows.
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So, @surfdado has a text message from Jeff stating the exact angle is 3.5° that he just posted to the Funwheel discord. Also, the Funwheel people stated the Thunder Rails have the same angle.
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@Samuraipunch said :
... Although in doing so might put them at risk of violating TFL's patent.... It'd be the shaping at least that's the point of contention, but the multiple holes to change axle height could be enough difference...
@biell said :
... Also, the Funwheel people stated the Thunder Rails have the same angle.
... probably as well the WBeams. Close to ~3° (+/-0.5°)
Many alternatives (with little nuances) despite TFL's patent. Demand determines the market and the price. -
@maciak So, essentially I will be doing something very similar to what you suggested here back in May.
First of all, I ordered the recent rerelease of WTF rails. So, that turned my problem from 1.77° nose high to 1.73° nose low. So, I went from Custom nose -1 to Custom nose +1.
I bought new aluminum spacers and will be replacing the middle one and the two font (furthest from the connectors) spacers, going up 1/32" with each step. By my calculations, this will be about 1.54°, leaving me 0.19° nose low. With that, I should be able to ride Mission. And, if not, I have been riding on Custom for a while now, this will just be one more iteration of that; I assume it would be Custom +0.1 or +0.2.
Edit: I almost forgot, I also ordered silicone heat transfer pads to make up for the added space between the integrated circuits and the pads, to ensure they don't fry.
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I run my WTF's at +3 and scrape the nose constantly. It's almost annoying but keeps me on my toes lol. For you running less than 3 degrees, are you mostly on flat ground?
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@biell Sorry have not been here often lately, life got demanding;)
Tbh nose-low is a pretty good thing on wtf's. I cannot imagine using a tiltkit on them since i ride pushback+ all the time and having my board back on straight rails temporarily last week literally killed my legs on my commute fighting PB. After work i had to swap around rails from 3 boards to get WTF's back on it.
Downside of riding PB is there is no 2nd PB to prevent you from eating it. This is a big issue cause i ride vesc mostly (27-30mph) and when going back to Wtf XR sometimes im constantly on the edge of nosediving.Edit: on a recent reddit post someone had an img of a 4212XR. Looks like the capacitors are different compared to pre 4209? Installing a tiltkit could be better on those..
